Henry Raymond
Fairfax News => Current News & Events => Topic started by: roadkill on February 09, 2010, 06:16:31 PM
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I was wondering if their are any drawings, plans, artist renditions of the Pavillion and Restroom facility with storage to be built at the Parks and Rec Dept land. Where are they going to be built? and are their any estimated maintenance costs associated with these 2 buildings? Article 7 doesnt consist of a dollar ammount, Does this mean that we are voting for them to be built at no expense to the tax payer? Will any of this information be availiable prior to Town meeting day?
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Hello!
I have some drawings and plans, as well as maps to the location and I've gathered data on the maintenance costs,As explained in early post - I'm hoping it will not cost the tax payers anything in the end, but we need to have some of the money 1st for one of the reimbursable grants. I'm pulling a whole presentation together for town meeting day, I hope to have it finished by mid-week next week and will post it and or e-mail it to people. E-mail me if you have specific questions so I can include the answers in my presentation and/or e-mail you the answers. Katrina
e-mail:fairfaxparksandrec@yahoo.com
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Below is Article 7:
ARTICLE 7 To see if the voters of the Town of Fairfax will authorize the building of a pavilion with
concession area and a restroom facility with storage in the Community Recreation
Park.
Did I miss something here? Where is the money coming from to build it? Are we voting on this some other place? Who will maintain it? Who will pay to maintain it? Who would have the answers on this??
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I guess we were both posting at the same time. Sorry about that Katrina, but I am hearing questions on this from people not registered who prefer not to post and are hoping to get some answers here.
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How much "1st time money" and Why is this not included in the Article?
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Oh come on ... It's for the kids!
Just vote Yes - to whatever they ask for ... what makes you ask such a question?
Remember - It's for the kids!
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I will have all the answers posted soon and I have most of them now. I have a sick kid and a very busy next few days. I will have all the information ready before town meeting. Please be patient and thank you and again - Please e-mail me questions, then I can have all the answers ready for everyone.
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Oh come on ... It's for the kids!
Just vote Yes - to whatever they ask for ... what makes you ask such a question?
Remember - It's for the kids!
Are your comments intended to be sarcastic or for real? I read it both ways.
Serious question though to whom ever could answer it; how many people attend these sporting events? What is the intended return on investment? (ROI)
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I would say I have to support the funding for a few reasons, 1) it will be paided back, 2) Building a common space for everyone to use is essential for building a sense of community here in Fairfax, 3) It encourages people to engage in physical fitness, 4) it is an excellent excuse to go out of your yard and enjoy nature, 5) its progress towards making outown more dynamic, 6) it will employ people, 7) it will possibly bring in tourists, more and more foot traffic to our local shops, 8) it makes the town even better.
Yes there is a cost, but all change and development does, dollar for dollar this is a great investment. - yes I am a penny pincher, and I don't want to see a bond being asked for to fund it, or our taxes going up. But seeing as the money is to be used up front, and if we can get it paid back....perhaps we can channel money from an over inflated budget to pay for, god only knows there are plenty of those!
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As I read article seven in its exact quoted context I can’t help but think that is a zoning question more than a taxpayer approval issue. This is based simply on the fact that the article does not present itself with any financial burden to the taxpayers as written. I am very interested in hearing about any underlying funding issues that may be presented, in the fact that a “reimbursable grant” is being sought.
The seeking of grants is commendable and as the primary grant writer for the fire department I can appreciate the time and commitment it takes to undertake such as process inundated with loopholes and red tape and realization that all the hard work may be for nothing if the grant is denied. From past experience the amount requested needs to be translucent in the article presented otherwise there may be much discussion and possible amendments to obtain the voter approval.
As my family and I frequent the recreation path I appreciate all the hard work and dedication it has taken to achieve what we have today and thank those for their commitment in making a vision grow into a reality.
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Again I am working all on the specifics, but I wanted to let everyone know that one of the reasons we don't have a cost on article 7 was at the time we were gathering signatures we did not have a cost estimate and we also did not know about the grants we had applied for. As of now - we have already received one of them - for $15,000. Again, I ask, please with any questions: e-mail me at fairfaxparksandrec@yahoo.com so I can include the answers in my presentation.
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I was curious if it will be on town water and sewer?
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In my opinion, it will be wonderful to have an area in town that we can have lots of different things there. We could posibly rent the space for weddings, fundraisers, family reunions etc. I know I would use it for many things. Fairfax is on its way to being a pretty quaint place to live. I like it.
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My name is Gary Stewart. "Roadkill" was a call sign given to me prior to retiring from the Army. I am not hiding behind a name on a computer. I really enjoy Henrys site, visit it daily, and am very gratefull that our community has such a forum and up to this point have always chose to be a member not a player.
To "Mummy", I never said how I was voting on this Article. Secondly to answer "How can I ask this question?" I was not the first to ask it. gpdvt did so on January 21st and the Parks and Rec Director responded on the 22nd that the numbers were almost ready and will be posted soon. "Warned item for Rec Dept needs signatures" dated January 19th.
I believe in Responsible Government, Responsible spending and in "Mummys" case responsible voting. This however is a right and anyone can vote any way they want.
I was the Parks and Rec Depts groundskeeper and am still currently the groundskeeper at school. I have been involved with this piece of property in one way or the other for the past 11 years since returning "Home" after retiring from the Army. I know all about graphitti, vandalism and the most efficient way to get a picnic table out of the river. ( Donald Pigeon's back hoe) This is a dynamic piece of property and I agree with MR32, SPLOTT and what Justin Hayes had to say. I regularly saw Justin and his family while working there.
To me its simple, If you cannot afford to maintain it, Don't build it. Maintenance costs never decrease. Our Town has beautifull sidewalks half the year. Here is a case of building something you can't afford to maintain. Kids walk down the side of the road in the winter when we need the sidewalks the most.
I believe in making informed decisions and that is impossible if the information is not availiable. This is an Australlian ballet item and to me that means the Selectboard is obligated to inform ALL 2,948 registers voters in Fairfax about this Article "If money is involved". I hear the Town report is being mailed out tomorrow.
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Re: Article 7
« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2010, 08:56:09 PM »
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Oh come on ... It's for the kids!
Just vote Yes - to whatever they ask for ... what makes you ask such a question?
Remember - It's for the kids!
Are your comments intended to be sarcastic or for real? I read it both ways.
Serious question though to whom ever could answer it; how many people attend these sporting events? What is the intended return on investment? (ROI)
DrewCrash - It is just that a comment - I cannot tell you how to think or what to think - That is up to you! It is what it is, it is for the kids and it is FREE money that someone worked hard to get - Why wouldn't you vote YES?
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Mummy - I believe Roadkill explained it well. It may be a grant ("free money") this year but eventually the free wears out. Upkeep of buildings - normal depreciation - will occur and the free money may not be there after the initial year; and the reality of vandalism is an added expense.
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As pointed out previously, the "free money" is NOT guaranteed. The grant is not awarded already, just applied for. I too commend all of the efforts of the people working on this project.
I enjoy walking the rec path occassionally. I think it's a great area that does encourage exercise (I certainly don't want to jog up and down 104 with my daughter in a stroller). HOWEVER, I don't believe the proposed building itself will encourage even more exercise, and I don't believe it will attract tourist to our town, and it is NOT free. I would vote in favor of this article IF it had the following conditions: proposed facility will be built ONLY if the upfront cost does not exceed $10,000 and a reimbursment grant is in place (awarded); and ALL profits from concession sales will be placed in a maintenance fund for the proposed building.
Finally, WHO will be responsible for maintenance? If there is still debate about whether the town or the school is going to maintain the fields, etc. then this maintenance issue needs to be resolved BEFORE any building is started.
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FREE MONEY?? Perhaps it seems that way to our generation but our children will certainly pay for this!
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Kudos to Gary, Terry & others......like I asked way back, I thought I remember voting @ a town meeting we did NOT feel the need for this building? All these things, maintenance, funding, etc., were brought up but yet the idea was still pursued. Sometimes I feel we don't always think longterm, like the upkeep & vandalism in the future. The port-a-lets seem to work fine; many schools have them when we traveled to soccer & baseball games. Maybe there are better ways to use grant monies, something that won't require constant upkeep. Who's going to answer the call when kids are down there trashing the place? I probably will take heat for this but I have lived here almost 30 years & have seen our town grow alot, some needed changes to keep with the times, but not always the case. Guess it bugs me that some move here because it's such a nice town, good schools, good location,etc., but then they try to change it & make it like the big cities they've come from....well at least the conveniences of the past. If you move to a small town, maybe someone should ask if that's what they really want - and not the small town with the perks? of a big city.
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I am one of "those" relocators and look at it differently. Not all change is good and I agree with that but new blood and energy can be. I do not think it matters where you come from. If you get involved in your community then you are a good community member. Some people exist and some people live. Facts of life. New blood does not necessarity come from big cities. It can come from the new generations coming from our community. Whether you have been here 30 years or 2 years what matters is what you do with your time here. Some of us try and have the energy to do so and others do not. No one is going to go their whole life without making a wrong decision. I personally would think that it is not asking a lot to have the home owner clear the sidewalks in front of their home. Europeans clean their own streets all the time. I also do not think it is asking a lot to help thy neighbor either. That is a debate in itself. Anyway, I am glad I came to Fairfax and I will offer my time to help in any way I can.
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here, here. P.S. I am a native Vermonter, who moved here from a small town, and I don't want to change anything, but every town could benefit from improvements, And regardless, our population is the 5th fasting growing in Vermont, and we have to keep up if we like it or not to accommodate the influx of new residents.
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I stand corrected. After reading the Town Report, I believe Article 7 will not be voted on by Austraiilan ballet but actually at Town Meeting. That explains alot. Last year only 6 percent of the registered voters attended Town meeting. I was hoping to go and support a local boy at the Burke Mountain sledd dog race, Mike and Sam Previs of Previs sled dog racing will be racing. He's also the President of the race. Go Mike. On a much sadder note the State will be closing another rest area shortly to save money, either the one in Waterford or the one in Lyndon, I guess you just pull off the side of the interstate and find a tree. Now thats "old school".
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3plusk might be right.
I do recall having heard many new folks indicating that Essex had all the perk's like Ice Skating Rinks, Parks, Bike Paths and good schools just to name a few. The conversation always end the same way ... "but we couldn't afford ANY house in Essex!" Is it possible these same folk want a Mini Essex at a price they can afford here in Fairfax? It does make me wonder now, if all these perks are developed here in Fairfax and these folks move away ... gee the longterm residents are stuck with the cost of maintaining these infrastructures.
Something to think about .... begin with the end in site!
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On a much sadder note the State will be closing another rest area shortly to save money, either the one in Waterford or the one in Lyndon, I guess you just pull off the side of the interstate and find a tree. Now thats "old school".
I wonder what the savings will ultimately be once the state starts cleaning the 'sites' from the messes that are left--if in fact they do. Someone just assumes that people will get off the interstate to use the facilities, but I have a fair amount of road trips logged on I89, 91, 93, and beyond and I can say with certainty:
When I gotta go, I gotta go, not all exits have readily available convenience stores with restrooms--some rural exits you have to drive several more miles in the middle of nowhere to get to a small village that may not have an open gas station. Then after you've driven for what seems far too long, you think maybe if you you had turned the other way you would have reached civilization sooner, so you turn back (after driving another 2-3 miles to locate a place to do so) and go the other way, passing the on ramp in search of life that must be ahead...by the time a restroom is located, you're nearly foaming at the mouth like a rabid dog, pushing aside small children with grandmothers and knocking over pregnant women just to get to it. It ain't pretty.
Neither is the paper mess that I have seen left at some rest stops in the woods.
I have noticed that as much as we complain about our roads here, they are (at least I89 anyway) in great shape compared to every interstate I have been on in another state. I90 (a toll road) is awful, but the rest stops are real nice and there is one about every 20-30 miles. I95 was pretty bad when I was on it last. It seems like the roads aren't tended to, but the rest stops are. It's just an interesting contrast. I suppose sacrifice has to made somewhere, but is there no compromise?
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It's nice to hear that "we" relocaters are carrying our load and became part of the community fairly quickly. Wonder how many old timers participate in keeping up with the demands? What will happen when they are gone? A town is like a barn, You can take care of it or you can let it cave in. Why bring back Fireworks if there is a chance of fire. Why have a new restaurant come to town in fear that no one will go. Why make the school bigger to accompdate Georgia if it is a possibility that people in Georgia stop having kids. FEAR, FEAR, FEAR. That will hold us back every time. I wish I would have had a little more fear last year when I had to plant my vegetable garden 3 times. Those "relocaters" spent a lot of money in this town trying to live up here and not knowing the hidden secrets. It all comes out in the wash. I would assume that there are a few businesses here in town that are owned by "out of town people" or "relocaters". Maybe it is time to be thankful rather than resentful.
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re: "I thought I remember voting @ a town meeting we did NOT feel the need for this building? All these things, maintenance, funding, etc., were brought up but yet the idea was still pursued."
There are many reasons to revisit a topic...we've all decided at one point not to take an action only to make a decision to do so at a later date.
As a member of the Parks and Rec Board, I supported bringing the request back to the voters. The park is being used more and more. Football alone has greatly increased the number of people in the park. Next season, little league will be using the fields. We (the Parks & Rec Board) want to make the park a place that many, many people will use for a wide variety of activities. It's not "just for the kids". We are proposing the facilities (rest rooms, storage, concession) to support the continued and increased use of the park.
We believe there is enough interest and support TO PRESENT THE POSSIBILITY of building the pavilion. That is what Article & does...presents an idea to vote on. There are many questions that need to be answered in order for voters to decide whether or not to support the request. Katrina is working on putting information together.
Margo Rome
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A lot of staid "old-timers" generally do not think outside of the box or will shoot down any possible solution to a perceived problem because that's how it is with everything. The issues of money, maintenance, upkeep, vandalism, etc., are all valid, as are the desires to continue to model the park after something we all have seen and appreciate elsewhere.
NO ONE IS WRONG!!
That's the good part. The issue is being able to come together and make it work: Think about who is involved with the park, what draws the most people there. You might find some answers or at least some ideas to jumpstart the brainstorming process as you're going along.
It's bee said at least a half dozen times a proposal was in the works--send ?? etc to an e-mail address, but it continued to be hashed out with out benefit of any real info...imagine how well we'd do with all the facts/figures and information needed to adequately debate an issue?!
The members of Henry's forum could probably put Montpelier out of business. :-)
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I guess I have to respond to the last statement -
I'm feeling frustated and really sad at the moment- I feel I give a lot of my time for our community, The park and recreation job is a part time job - 5- 10 hours a week it is budgeted for - I often work at least 20, many volunteer hours, I'm not looking for sympathy or anything, but to explain. I also have another job that requires me to work full time next week and I'm also a full time stay at home mom with a 2 and 4 year old. I will get the information out - I want the correct information, with correct numbers, and it will be presented at town meeting. I will try my hardest to get it out sometime next week. I will have limited access to Henry's website for the next few days so if you want - I've given the information on how to contact me.
Katrina
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Don't give up or lose faith, your efforts are appreciated, but it never seems it in the midst of controversy. Patience is a virtue hard to come by. When it all works out and it eventually will, all will be good. I believe there is some country song out there with a chorus something along these lines: "When you're going through hell, just keep on going..." I'm not a hard-core country fan, so I've never heard the song, other than that line and couldn't say who sings it, but I like the sentiment.