Henry Raymond
Fairfax News => Current News & Events => Topic started by: Henry on February 11, 2010, 09:27:43 AM
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A while back, the following post appeared under announcements:
This was sent by e-mail to the Fairfax News.
Nice room for rent in Fairfax house $675/month included utilities.
Great for gardeners. Pool and privacy. Many trails for hiking, biking cross country skiing and snow shoeing and camping. Less than I mile from Historic Fairfax Falls. No dogs, but cat would be great. Lots of storage space. Can accommodate immediately and very glad to help move, shift and arrange.
In a reply to the post someone mentioned that they did not know you could do that.
I thought for sure that someone would bring up the fact that, No, indeed, you can't do that. It is apparently a very little known fact that renting rooms changes the use from a Single Family Home to a Rooming and Boarding House, and the change of use requires a permit. It is possible that it will also require approval from Our Development Review Board. It may also affect the requirement for sewer and water allocations if the home is on Town Sewer and/or Water.
Rental properties may also need some State Permits and inspections regarding electric and plumbing systems, fire and CO detection, and proper ingress and egress. One would need to contact the State Dept of Labor and Industry regarding State Permits.
Fairfax has had a number of boarding houses over the years. My wife's grandmother, Nellie Rooney, who used to live in a big old house that used to be across from where Mildred Warren lives used to board teachers that taught at BFA. One of the teachers that taught at BFA and boarded there was Loretta (Howrigan) Magnan. Although Loretta only lived up on The Howrigan Road in Fletcher, back in those days, people did not travel as far to work, thus she boarded here and went home on weekends. Also, there were some tuition students that boarded here while they went to BFA and before that some who went to The Hampton Institute. My mother-in-law, Kay Hoben used to also board teachers as well as a sawyer who worked up at Joe Peloquin's Saw Mill in Mill Hill. In addition to that she also ran a Guest Home, and I believe needed a state license for that as I remember seeing it in a little frame on the wall near the front door where guests registered. She lived just above John & Sue Mitchell's at the time.
You see it mentioned from time to time about people living with older people, but I suspect here in Fairfax our zoning bylaws would not allow that either.
Maybe, just maybe, our zoning bylaws need to be changed just a bit to lighten the requirement on someone renting a room. I wouldn't think that most people would have a problem with someone renting a room to someone.
I would be interested in hearing other people's opinion on this and just what are your feelings about someone renting a room. In these tough economic times, it sure does sound like a good solution.
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I personally think it is your house so you can do with it what you want. Why should it be up to the town to decide if you rent a room or not. The taxes, water, sewer and electric will still be paid. I know when I was going to college I rented a few studio apartments which was about all I could afford, it helped the single women afford to have their own place and it was safe. I know that kids these days have a hard time learning to be independent because of the money issue. Renting a room is good. They have their independence and can call it their own but....... My dad died a few years ago and my mom lived in Washington State. We enclosed our garage and made a large room for her to live in. I would be mortified if someone told me I had to have a permit for my mother to live with us or if we had to pay more taxes while we took care of our aging parents. That is in my opinion, not their business. It is my house and I can do with it what I wish. Understanding financial hardship, it may be the only thing that helps some of us keep our homes. Good topic Henry.
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Not sure if the law still stands but - if my memory serves me correctly, it's also illegal to charge a pet deposit if the landlord allows pets. They might have changed that though since the last time i rented ( years ago ) as a pet could do some considerable damage by themselves.
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OMG ... hang on it is going to be a bumpy ride!
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Does this mean I don't get paid for the ad ?
I need to hear some reasons why we should not allow this.
What's the downside ?
Anyone ?
Miss Kitty ???
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As long as they follow the necessary laws/regulations there's no reason why they can't do it. Those rules have been put in place to protect the renter and the landlord/owner. On a slippery slope argument, 1 renter..not a big problem, but what if someone starts renting all their unused bedrooms? As a neighbor I might get a little annoyed at the increase in vehicles, noise etc not to mention who are these renters?? Ex-cons? Sex offenders? that sorta thing.
For the person who is renting out a room I do hope they have checked all the legalities, ex. leases, insurance etc. If you let someone move into your home and take money from them for that purpose, you better have some sort of lease as otherwise you will have a very hard time ever getting them out of there, if that need arises, especially if you have done it without the necessary permits.
I owned a duplex in Winooski, and was amazed at the little things you had to pay attention to as far as legalities and liabilities. Winooski had fairly strict procedures/inspections when it came to apartments. The state also has the lead paint laws that HAD to be obeyed, including taking a class and filing yearly paperwork.
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Too much can and will be discussed on this topic, however, the long and short of this topic is no one can control what goes on in your House! Being respectful of whom you rent to is the bonus here, otherwise you can have well issues. Who is going to tell a home owner that they can not have their partner and off springs and perhaps their off springs - living in your house? There may be laws pertaining to this issue but to implement them - now that is a very long story and you could be onto your next Lover (and their off springs -off springs) by the time someone figures out these laws!
Or what is the difference between the above and a home owner with children, foster kids, ex husband and a new lover with children? There are always exceptions - the exceptions go on and on - there is no end to the scenarios. The bottom line, we all have to learn to get along with whatever test we are given to deal with from the higher source!
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as a professional plumber I have to obey the code laws ,I have lost more jobs because the people were going to rent above the garage or make it rental property and therefore I would have to get the permits to alter the dwelling ,because of this my price would be higher that joe handyman and would lose a ton of work to the midnight plowboy ,THERE ARE ALOT OF THEM IN TOWN but noone inforces them so ,ethier I go hungry or when in rome????
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Our town does have rules & what's good for 1 should be followed by the other. Awhile back there was a party interested in having a B&B on Fletcher Rd. To my knowledge, they did lots of work inside but they unfortunately were not allowed to have their dream due to a water & possible sewer issue. It was brought up @ 1 of the meetings that there is a boarding house on main street that had never gone through the town to have their business but the zoning administrator had no knowledge of it. Well, people there told him & that place is still going today...just ask some neighbors of the noise! So, for the people on Fletcher rd., there could be a family with 10 kids there all the time, but not a B&B. For the place on Main st. they could do what they wanted, it seems. I can see having the town having guidelines to roomers/boarders. As kids grow up & leave home, we end up with the extra rooms, (shh don't tell them as it's nice for them to visit but....!), so why not rent 1 out for income? That may be the only way I can afford to stay in my home eventually. As for the question on charging extra deposit for pets, I'd like to know if it's true since my brother moved into an apartment in Burl. & was charged extra for his cat; my son who lives @ the cape had to pay extra for his place for the cat plus extra every month to have the cat! That's what the damage deposit should be for in the 1st place.......don't think the cats uses much extra water/sewer/heat or whatever on his own.
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I will never understand the B&B thing and I hope my dreams are never in the hands of one person. I think it would have been a great asset to Fairfax to have another B&B. I rather have a B&B there than a empty house. What is the issue with the water anyway? Why does it matter if I use it or a guest of mine?
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The town has a very antiquated system that is at it's maximun capacity now. Any extra stresses would dramatically impact the 'load'. The town can not afford to buy a new up dated system, and presently we can live with it at its max, but can not enlarge it's capacity to accommodate extra use.
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That makes sense about the sewer on one hand, but this seems to be about someone renting an empty room in a home already built for a family of presumably four (at least) I don't see why it should be an issue for someone to rent a room in their house that was previously used by another person or not for that matter. It's similar to being roommates. i don't think it's the town's business who is in your home. Some people have relatives from out of state who visit for long periods during the year, so if someone's parents/siblings/niece or nephew come to stay for a month or to live with them for several months (and sleeps in the family room on a pullout hide-a-bed) is that different because they may or may not be paying rent on the space?
If grandma moves in because she's ill or mom dad & kids move in with gram for same (might be easier on her) temporary or otherwise, this is ok, but renting a room to a stranger to make ends meet isn't? I personally don't see the difference.
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Back to the water issue. What is the difference between a 8 bedroom house having 8 kids at all times or a 8 bedroon house having guests. Water is water.? Please explain because I really do not understand. Same with businesses. They have no busness water but they do have residential? What is the difference?
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Many of these questions are answered in The Town of Fairfax's zoning regulations. They are available online, via a link from this site. Zoning differentiates between single family, single family with an "accessory apartment", duplex, etc. So there are legal "limits" as to what someone can do with their property, and the rules changes not only from town to town, but also from one district to another within this town (i.e., what can be done in the designated growth center is different than what is allowed in the conservation district).
There are lots of pros and cons regarding zoning. The discussion can, and should, continue forever, and changes will be needed as times and the needs of the townfolk change.
Margo Rome
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Well it is illegal to pay the kid up the road 20 bucks under the table to mow the lawn or babysit your kids to. do people do it still? Of course!!
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When your talking design rates for water consumption between a residential unit, and commercial unit it is a little different. For example, when designing for a residential unit it is all based on how many bedrooms are in the house, and the design rate is 70gpd (gallons per day), the first 3 bedrooms are assumed to have double occupancy. So with an 8 bedroom home your talking a design flow of 770gpd.
When you change that same 8 bedroom residence to a commercial B&B different flows come into effect. The bedrooms turn into "boarding house, room rentals" which is 100gpd per bedroom. Serving meals is also considered at a rate of 50gpd per seat, so if theres a 10 chair table thats an additional 500gpd. If theres a commercial laundry machine there to clean all the linens and such thats also an additional 500gpd. With just this little bit of information the B&B is up to 1800gpd. So just with these numbers the design flow for the B&B is more then doubled the residential unit eventhough its the exact same property being used.
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Thanks for the insight Shady... Although I don't totally agree with the numbers, at least we understand the reasoning behind it.
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I don't necessarily agree with alot of the numbers in the ANR's Wastewater System and Potable Water Supply Rules either, and in alot of cases like this the engineer will perform a fixture count to try and get a more accurate design flow. Just quickly trying to show the difference between the two scenarios.
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Thanks for the explanation on numbers for the water/sewer. But it still boils down to IF the B&B was full, those #s are real, but how often would the B&B be full.....( there are 3? in town?) .....BUT, if a family has 6 children, those rooms ARE full always, (maybe a little over as friends stay over), so those #s for a family are more realistic, and maybe not enough if they had a kid like mine that takes a long shower....until I threaten to go in & turn it off myself!! I liked your comment Josh on paying the kid under the table to mow the law or babysit; BUT the state does have specifics for "babysitting" & not more than 2 families can be cared for or the "babysitter" MUST become registered, take classes & more, as they will face possible fines if the state finds out & parents stuck without a "babysitter"! BUT, those 2 families can have any number of kids & that's OK, BUT a registered daycare can legally have 6 full time & 4 part-time kids. Sorry, that's a whole different topic but just goes to show how rules can sometimes seem a little ......stupid?.....not fair?......not accurate?