Interesting Points Made By Bernie Sanders

[mirjo]

I know he's not favored by the majority of my right wing pals here, but I happen to think Bernie Sanders has his heart in the right place in most situations as far as politicians go. In the following Youtube video he's giving an impassioned speech to the president about what he believes is an injustice to the American people.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5OtB298fHY&feature=player_embedded#

I think this was before the senate vote on the tax cuts. Personally, I am really disgusted that the republicans in congress so willingly stand up and talk out of both sides of their mouth about money. I am equally disgusted that we have such a weak president unwilling to stand up to their ridiculous demands. He should have  listened to Shumer--I think that's who it was, and  agreed to compromise on the millionaires  and up, but he's a wuss! You can't trust a bully and you can't trust a wuss. That leaves us pretty much screwed.

I'm sorry guys--Ed (dba Rod) Thor, Chris, Josh, Ron et-al, but if you're in agreement with the GOP on this one that the Bush tax cuts need to be extended for the good of the economy--(because  trickle down economics has worked so well)--I will tell you you're nuts, but not before  asking you to explain your rationale and cite sources!

[Thor]

Mirjo,

     Weak President..... how can that be?.... he had so much experience behind him... he was so ready to CHANGE things...! Wasn't it Obama who said..."We live in the greatest country in the world; please help me change it"? This guy is a total TOOL, and he has probably signed his own "Not to be re-elected" ticket.

     One other point; "should've listened to Schumer" and agreed to compromise on the millionaires and up. Maybe that didn't happen because the Dems don't understand what defines a millionaire. You, yourself told me that someone making $400 - $500K a year was "close enough to a millionaire" or something to that effect.

     I ain't no rocket scientist, but the first part of problem solving is to DEFINE what the problem is. If the Dems can't even come together on a definition, how the hell are they gonna agree on a bill? Does a millionaire make $250K a year, $400K a year, $500K a year, or does he actually make a million or more a year? From where I am sitting, that question looks pretty easy to answer without even cheating!! Maybe a good test would be to ask Ed!

[cedarman]

The deal is a fabulous one.

Everyone gets what they want.  The rich get richer, and the unemployed continue to be supported by the system.  Oh, and don't forget the payroll tax holiday.

With the recent printing problems at the US treasury ($110 BILLION dollars that cost $120 million to print going for destruction), it's a good thing we have the Fed. Reserve to write a few more checks.

[Thor]

Right on Cedarman. I have mentioned it a couple of times in other threads, but you nailed it. THE biggest threat to our society is the Fed. We have got to do away with that criminal element.

[cedarman]

I think I'm going to start spending my way to prosperity.
Not only am I going to spend even more money, but I'm going to tell my rich boss that I don't want a raise next year so he can help me along my path to prosperity because rich people are so good about willingly parting with their money (do a search of generosity vs income).

I wonder how much I can use my plastic before it starts to melt?

[Thor]

Cedarman, I have never missed a mortgage payment or any other payment for that matter. And yet, the people who overextended themselves got all the mortgage breaks. Funny how that works. I wish someone would offer me 2% or better for an interest rate. Guess you had to get in way over your head in order to qualify!

And in regards to spending your way to being rich, isn't that what our gov't is doing? Just keep spending, if we need more, we can print it! If I ran my business like these idiots we have running the state and federal checkbooks, I am pretty sure someone would be knocking at my door.

But on you go... melt those cards. When one max's out, just get another card, and so on.... then declare bankruptcy. Maybe the Fed's will bail you out!!

[cedarman]

If the gov't can spend it's way to prosperity, I should be able to do it too.  If It doesn't work, I can demand a gov't bailout.

OH WAIT, I forgot.  I'm not a banker, or giant insurance company.

I've never missed a mortgage payment either. My credit rating is excellent (which is pretty much just good for lower car insurance cost, but I bet I'm saving more by paying in full instead of payments).  I've managed to pay off all my consumer debts in the past 3 yrs (after over a decade of paying thousands a year in interest), and have realized how great it feels to build sufficient savings to be able to buy the things I NEED outright, and deal with emergencies without running up a load of debt.

I can only hope we can get enough sensible politicians into gov't in time for our country to turn that same fiscal corner before we end up like Ireland and Greece.

[Stand Alone Defense]

Mirjo, There is no reason to apologize about your point of view. You have a right that is forwarded to you to express it in our great country.

As far as me not agreeing with you? Well don't be so quick to Judge.  I do agree with you that Obama is a weak president and really just lacks leadership skills and over all experience.

Now as far as me agreeing with either side the Dems. or the Reps. that I do not! I don't get caught up in the whole Party war to be honest I believe that there are smart people on both sides of the Isle. I do side with the Republican side more as of late this is true but that is because I think the Dems have gone to far left as a whole. They have lost touch with America as a whole in my opinion.  "Don't ask don’t tell" is one example that I will use.  Our country is still fighting on 2 fronts; we are going belly up with spending, and our budget??... well lets face there is no budget because we just keep printing and spending.  These are big problems that need attention ASAP!! I think we can all agree on this? Well let’s work on these problems and not worry about weather or not you can be openly gay in the Military. If the Democrats put half the time they have put into that into trying to balancing the budget we might get somewhere.

On the don't ask don't tell policy also.  I have served 6 years on the active duty side, 2 combat tours in Iraq and another tour to a hot zone the HOA (Horn of Africa). I can tell you that really when I'm getting shot at I don't care if the guy/girl next to me is Gay and 98% of the troops feel the same way.  The thing is though when our guys/girls are getting shot at and are our there putting their life on the line for our country do you really think that it is the best time to be messing with things and trying to change things around?  It is not. It is actually flat out Asinine that it is even being discussed at this time in my opinion.  Ok off my soap box LOL

Over all really I am just for less government as a whole! In my opinion all this bailing out that took place was not a place the government should have even considered going!! If you are an idiot and run your Business into the ground well sucks to be you! Someone will step up probably with a better product and a better business plan and take your spot.  Cedarman and Thor I agree how stupid it is that our government has well pretty much rewarded people who are fiscal morons!! I can go out and buy new cars a fourwheeler and some other cool toys to bury myself in debt. Then when I can’t afford it the government helps me out with other people’s tax dollars or rewards me with changing my interest rate to 2%?  If anyone thinks that this is the way things should be I have a word to label you as and it is an Idiot.


   

[Chris Santee]

Mirjo, this is nothing new. History and facts make me side with the R's on this. In the 60's I agreed with the D's on this.
I completely understand why the concept is hard to swallow, but history shows it works.
Here's some reading to start you off.......
http://www.house.gov/jec/fiscal/tx-grwth/reagtxct/reagtxct.htm

for those short on time, or not so economically educated, here's the summary:
The Reagan tax cuts, like similar measures enacted in the 1920s and 1960s, showed that reducing excessive tax rates stimulates growth, reduces tax avoidance, and can increase the amount and share of tax payments generated by the rich. High top tax rates can induce counterproductive behavior and suppress revenues, factors that are usually missed or understated in government static revenue analysis. Furthermore, the key assumption of static revenue analysis that economic growth is not affected by tax changes is disproved by the experience of previous tax reduction programs. There is little reason to expect static revenue analysis to evaluate the economic or distributional effects of current tax reform proposals much better than it evaluated the Reagan tax program 15 years ago.

Merry Christmas to All !!!

[Chris Santee]

Here's an example of how I used this locally in business.

In 2001, Lee Minor came to me and asked me to run the Fairfax News.
It owed Buyer's Digest well over a thousand bucks and was floundering.

The first thing I did to make MORE money was reduce the advertising prices.
$85 ads were reduced to $50, $45 ads to $25, etc., etc., etc.
Some thought I was nuts and this would be the end of the paper,
but new advertisers started calling, and old advertisers loved the idea (some got bigger ads).

We paid BD within months, got ahead, and we're still here in a time when newspapers are getting hit hard.

And it's still FREE !
 

[Chris Santee]

Our Congressman disagrees with me:

Welch and 53 House Democrats oppose Obama tax deal               
In letter to Speaker, they say “Don’t back down” from commitment to middle class
               
WASHINGTON, DC – In a significant demonstration of opposition to President Obama’s tax deal, Congressman Peter Welch (D-Vt.) and 53 members of the U.S. House came out against the President’s proposal Thursday morning.
 
In a letter sent to Speaker Pelosi Thursday, Welch and his colleagues called the proposal “fiscally irresponsible” and “grossly unfair.”
 
“America is wading into fiscal quicksand. Borrowing nearly a trillion dollars to finance tax cuts that disproportionately favor millionaires and billionaires threatens our ability to create jobs, grow the middle class and protect seniors,” Welch said. “Digging the country deeper into debt to pay for misguided tax policy is irresponsible and simply doesn’t make sense.”
 
The letter, which Welch authored and first circulated late Monday, was signed by: Reps. Earl Blumenauer, Judy Chu, Yvette Clark, Steve Cohen, John Conyers, Elijah Cummings, Danny Davis, Peter DeFazio, Donna Edwards, Keith Ellison, Anna Eshoo, Sam Farr, Bob Filner, Barney Frank, John Garamendi, Alan Grayson, Raul Grijalva, Luis Gutierrez, Alcee Hastings, Martin Heinrich, Maurice Hinchey, Rush Holt, Jay Inslee, Jesse Jackson, Sheila Jackson-Lee, Paul Kanjorski, Dennis Kucinich, Barbara Lee, John Lewis, Ben Ray Lujan, Steven Lynch, Doris Matsui, Jim McDermott, Mike Michaud, Jim Oberstar, John Olver, Chellie Pingree, David Price, Tim Ryan, Linda Sanchez, Jan Schakowsky, Carol Shea-Porter, Adam Smith, Jackie Speier, Pete Stark, Betty Sutton, Bennie Thompson, Mike Thompson, Paul Tonko, Anthony Weiner, Lynn Woolsey, David Wu and John Yarmuth.
 
The full text of the letter is copied below:
 
Dear Madam Speaker,
 
We oppose acceding to Republican demands to extend the Bush tax cuts to millionaires and billionaires for two reasons.
 
First, it is fiscally irresponsible. Adding more than $900 billion to our national debt, as this proposal would do, handcuffs our ability to offer a balanced plan to achieve fiscal stability without a punishing effect on our current commitments, including Social Security and Medicare. 
 
Second, it is grossly unfair. This proposal will hurt, not help, the majority of Americans in the middle class and those working hard to get there. Even as Republicans seek to add billions more to our national debt in tax cuts to the wealthy, they oppose extending unemployment benefits to workers and resist COLA increases to seniors.
 
Without a doubt, the very same people who support this addition to our debt will oppose raising the debt ceiling to pay for it.
 
We support extending tax cuts in full to 98 percent of American taxpayers, as the President initially proposed. He should not back down. Nor should we.
 
Sincerely,
 
PETER WELCH
Member of Congress

[Chris Santee]

Our Congressman's claim that this would add $900B to our National Debt is unfounded, as show in the link above.

I remember the quote "You're going to add to the Fairfax News' debt".

I hope this helps, mirjo, and again.............

Merry Christmas to All !

[Stand Alone Defense]

And Merry Christmas to you Chris!!

[mkr]

Excellent Example Chris!  Merry Chirstmas!

I am not a Dem or Rep, I vote for the person and the issues I believe should be important at the time.  I do not blame the President for everything gone wrong in his efforts to change, I blame everyone in DC.  They all need a kick in the butt, put in timeout, and then have to sit down, act like adults, and work to compromise for the better of ALL the people, not some of the people.



 

[Thor]

mkr,

     That ain't gonna help. Those are professional politicians, who don't have to do anything they don't want. You seem to forget that WE are here for THEM, not the other way around. It was supposed to be THEY serve us to make things better than before, but once they get there, they get exposed to being above the law, and better than the working class person. I heard a saying once that sounded something like this; "All politicians should be limited to two terms, one in office and the other in prison". Personally I would like to sit all those clowns down and give them a class on leadership, decision making, prioritization, incremental problem solving and probably most important, show them the U.S. Constitution, as it seems none of them (except a couple, I will give the benefit of the doubt) seem to know what that document is all about.