flashing yellow light after dark

[Mummy]

Lock your doors when approaching the flashing yellow light in town after dark.  There has been a group of adults hanging out there and you don't see them because they are in the shade next to the red house.  Don't know where they come from but often I see misc cars entering at night and someone approaches the car and off the car goes.  Not sure what the attraction is there after dark, does anyone know?

[rod anode]

meth lab???

[Stand Alone Defense]

There has been that sort of activity taking place there for at least 3 years now those appartments seem to attrack a rough crowd for some reason.  When I work for the Sherrifs Dept. the area was talked about quite a bit.

[slpott]

So the obvious question should be "Why Not" This is ridiculous.

[Mummy]

That was what I thougt .... Why not?  No one to question you.

[Stand Alone Defense]

Well you know that loitering Ordinance that I ask about introducing a year ago would be a prime fit for this situation.  I only got negative feed back from all residents though so here we are.  There is nothing illegal about hanging out in group no matter what time it is so what do you want Law Enforcement to do?

[Judi]

I might add that I know they aren't fishing at 9:00 pm off River Road when a bunch of trucks pull in for 1/2 an hr. and then all leave at once squeeling tires and speeding all the way down the road.  This happens at least three times a month.  They don't even have time to drink a beer so you can guess what the interaction is all about.  And this is on private land so the Sheriff isn't patroling!

[monte198]

Judi,

I am unsure if you mean the pulloff on river rd where fishing does take place.  As far as i know there is nothing there stating it is private property and it is maintained by the town.  It this is to be deemed private then there needs to be signs a barricades put up.  You cannot enforce private property if it is not posted.

[Stand Alone Defense]

I believe she is speaking of the spot after the bridge across from Shepardson Hollow RD.

[Mummy]

Well you know that loitering Ordinance that I ask about introducing a year ago would be a prime fit for this situation.  I only got negative feed back from all residents though so here we are.  There is nothing illegal about hanging out in group no matter what time it is so what do you want Law Enforcement to do?



This is only my way of thinking but ... someone selling drugs or worse isn't going to follow a Loitering Ordinance ... perhaps in a perfect world.   Also,  if the Sheriff can't control Th's illegal Loitering or the Stat Troopers  how would a Loitering Ordinance enforced by the Town or Town Constable  going to work?  Perhaps I don't understand.! 

[Stand Alone Defense]

It would allow Trooper's, Sheriff's or the Constable to make contact with people.  You can't as a police officer just walk up to someone give them a hard time then pat them down and find drugs like in the movies.  Those cases don't ever make it to court because the initial interaction was not legal.  It wouldn't matter if the cop finds 3 pounds of coke on the guy if it was obtained through a unlawful means IE. a bad stop it is no good.  A loitering ordinance would allow an officer to see a group of people hanging out in the center of town and make a lawful interaction with them.  At that point while the officer is speaking with them he can build reasonable suspicion.  Do they smell like marijuana? is their behavior eratic? if they are under 21 do the smell of alcohol? this helps a good officer build a case to search someone and find drugs or contraband.  Then in a perfect world that subject will flip on his buddies and so on.

Have you ever been pulled over for having a License plate light out at 1130pm on your way home?  The officer doesn't really care about your plate light... It does however give him a reason to make contact with you and see if you are a drunk driver.

Oh and yes you are right someone that is dealing drugs or worse isn't going to listen to the ordinance that is the point.  we don't want them to.

[Mummy]

Yes, I have been stopped at 3 a.m. in Milton.  The first thing the Police asked me was "Where are you going?" then "Where are you coming from?"  He was disappointed to hear "to home and from work."  Any way ~ I think it is obvious to most of us that it is here in Fairfax.  What I heard on TV about the ST. Albans and Georgia bust was "I just mind my own business!" Or "I live right next to them but never knew what was going on!"   What should be evaluated now by everyone reading this is .... at what point is it your business? 

[Stand Alone Defense]

Courts have been battling with that question as long as there has been a little thing called the Bill of Rights that pesky 4th Amendment LOL.  It sucks but Criminals have rights to often it seems they have more rights then us Law Abiding Citizens.

[Judi]

You are correct, the spot after the bridge and across from Shepardson Hollow Rd is the place I am referring to!

[mmillette]

It would allow Trooper's, Sheriff's or the Constable to make contact with people.  You can't as a police officer just walk up to someone give them a hard time then pat them down and find drugs like in the movies.  Those cases don't ever make it to court because the initial interaction was not legal.  It wouldn't matter if the cop finds 3 pounds of coke on the guy if it was obtained through a unlawful means IE. a bad stop it is no good.  A loitering ordinance would allow an officer to see a group of people hanging out in the center of town and make a lawful interaction with them.  At that point while the officer is speaking with them he can build reasonable suspicion.  Do they smell like marijuana? is their behavior eratic? if they are under 21 do the smell of alcohol? this helps a good officer build a case to search someone and find drugs or contraband.  Then in a perfect world that subject will flip on his buddies and so on.

Have you ever been pulled over for having a License plate light out at 1130pm on your way home?  The officer doesn't really care about your plate light... It does however give him a reason to make contact with you and see if you are a drunk driver.

Oh and yes you are right someone that is dealing drugs or worse isn't going to listen to the ordinance that is the point.  we don't want them to.

I agree with all these things!! If we do not do something it just gets out of hand. My kids are young and starting to get to the age that they want to just hang out with friends and this would be a great way to control the where when and who they can just hang out with. When I was young the was a ordinance like this and it just like FXDHS said it didn't stop it put law enforcement could approach the situation!!